Interwiki Redirect Pages

[Matt]

I'm bringing this to attention here. Zelda Wiki.org recently attempted to set up redirects to take users directly to Smash Wiki. They're breaking several special pages.
http://zeldawiki.org/Special:WantedPages
http://zeldawiki.org/Special:BrokenRedirects
http://zeldawiki.org/Special:DoubleRedirects

All the errors currently on there are caused by redirect pages to Smash Wiki. I'm told that other NIWA wikis had this kind of trouble too.

One of our users has this to say about it:

A bit early to come up with a conclusion, but here's what I think: The wiki takes the redirect and sees if it exists in the domain.

ie. It will look to see if zeldawiki.org/ssb:Dream Land exists, not ssbwiki.com/Dream Land
If that is the case, we either have to:
1. Fix the wiki from the inside
2. Delete the redirects

So the questions I have are: Are other wikis here having the same problem? If so, have you figured out anything about them? And then what could we do about them? If we can't fix it, should we all abandon these kind of redirects and instead make a more of "soft" redirects like what are used on Wikimedia sites (for example, German proverbs)?

[Toomai]

If interwiki redirects were possible I'd think Wikipedia would have done it by now.

[Miles of SmashWiki]

I don't see anything wrong with following the WikiMedia example and using soft redirects.

[tacopill]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

[Matt]

If interwiki redirects were possible I'd think Wikipedia would have done it by now.

It is of course possible. I think it might be just this problem that lead Wikipedia to using soft redirects instead. It's not exactly a high priority bug to fix I'd imagine. So it fits.

[Garrett]

Links to other wikis should be handled through interwiki links (either directly or as templates), not redirects. Wikipedia avoids interwiki redirects because the significant downsides outweigh the very minor benefits.

[tacopill]

Links to other wikis should be handled through interwiki links (either directly or as templates), not redirects. Wikipedia avoids interwiki redirects because the significant downsides outweigh the very minor benefits.

Which downsides would those be?

[Garrett]

Which downsides would those be?

I was specifically referring to "hard" redirects, in case that wasn't clear; as well as the reasons mentioned above there's the added hassle of maintaining the redirects. The normal "redirected from" links don't appear across wikis, so you need to approach the page in an indirect manner in order to edit it.

Redirects (soft or not) are advantageous if you're wanting an external page to appear in a local category, but other than that one instance the only actual difference is whether you have to type a couple of extra characters when first adding a link on a page.

[Matt]

Which downsides would those be?

Yeah, I mentioned that Wikimedia sites probably avoid them for good reason.

They are:

• They break every single special page that has to do with pages linking to other pages.
• They have to be edited in a roundabout way.
• Marking new ones as patrolled requires very indirect ways of reaching the page. Such as certain, rarely used, special pages or manual URL manipulation.

There may be others, but those are most important.

[SnorlaxMonster]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

[tacopill]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

That's a glitch....

It filled up one row with

Code Select Expand


"Fox McCloud (edit) →‎ Fox McCloud →‎ Fox McCloud"

how can it redirect to itself - twice?

[Nintendoguy1]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

That's a glitch....

It filled up one row with

Code Select Expand


"Fox McCloud (edit) ?? Fox McCloud ?? Fox McCloud"

how can it redirect to itself - twice?

It's because those are interwiki links, it's not a glitch - it's just not working properly.

[tacopill]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

That's a glitch....

It filled up one row with

Code Select Expand


"Fox McCloud (edit) ?? Fox McCloud ?? Fox McCloud"

how can it redirect to itself - twice?

It's because those are interwiki links, it's not a glitch - it's just not working properly.

um... last i checked "not working properly" would be considered a glitch.

[Nintendoguy1]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

That's a glitch....

It filled up one row with

Code Select Expand


"Fox McCloud (edit) ?? Fox McCloud ?? Fox McCloud"

how can it redirect to itself - twice?

It's because those are interwiki links, it's not a glitch - it's just not working properly.

um... last i checked "not working properly" would be considered a glitch.

Well, a glitch is when coding which is intended to do one thing goes wrong, this thing was just never meant to be redirected so it's technically not going wrong.

[tacopill]

check out: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/w/index.php?title=Fox_McCloud&redirect=no.

It works perfectly, except that it fills up Special:DoubleRedirects

That's a glitch....

It filled up one row with

Code Select Expand


"Fox McCloud (edit) ?? Fox McCloud ?? Fox McCloud"

how can it redirect to itself - twice?

It's because those are interwiki links, it's not a glitch - it's just not working properly.

um... last i checked "not working properly" would be considered a glitch.

Well, a glitch is when coding which is intended to do one thing goes wrong, this thing was just never meant to be redirected so it's technically not going wrong.

Ah, ok. Then the makes more sense.

Still, if it is not a glitch, i would consider it at least a bug, which has a much looser definition.